Note: This is an AI-generated transcript and may have transcription errors. We apologize for any inconvenience this may cause.

Robert Berkeley  0:02  

Hello, and thank you for joining me once again. I'm Robert Barkley, your host for another episode of Inside Jjobs, the podcast for in house agencies about in house agency leaders and brought to you by the Iin Hhouse Aagency Fforum or IHAF have in partnership with Express KCS, who helped many in house agencies do so much more through outsource production. This episode, we get to meet a Arancha Muelasrancher Mueller's, who've already had the pleasure of knowing for some years now, she runs the in house agency within Vvistaprint, who in turn actually helps small businesses create their own custom marketing. While Vvistaprint marketing operation is based in Boston, Massachusetts, Aranchaurantia herself lives and works principally in Barcelona, Spain, which brings with it various challenges. But before we get into those, I asked her AranchaRancho Where does she come from? And how did she get into marketing in the first place?

 

Arancha Muelas  0:52  

Yes, sure. So Well, as you were saying, probably the audience can tell from my accent, I'm originally from Spain. I specifically, I was born in Madrid. And I'm gonna cgo all the way back to when I was a teenager, because that's when I think my story really starts. And back then, I had a dream, I knew what I wanted to do for the rest of my life. And so one day, I went to see my mom and I told her, I want to be an archaeologist. And you can imagine her face at that moment. My mom, she was more than practical type of woman. And she said, Yes, okay. Well, if you literally said, if you want to live under a bridge, probably, you know, you're you're in a good path. But I would suggest you do something more practical in life. And I ended up in business school. And I don't regret that I have to say, you know, has given me the foundation and the background of what I needed to succeed. later on. He has given me the tools, because in business call you to touch all areas, right from from accounting, from finance, HR, or marketing, to what I believe it has been the fundamental of my career. And it was an international business management with a couple focus specifically on marketing, and HR. If you see my career, and my my more what I'm doing at the moment, there's certainly been a creative component. So communication component into that. And so marketing is the area that it felt it was closer to what I Exactly.

 

Robert Berkeley  2:24  

When did you Wait, are you kind of a sort of hobbyist artist or creative in your own way? Were you good at drawing or painting or anything like that?

 

Arancha Muelas  2:31  

Yeah, definitely. And one of the story continues. I went to art school following marketing. So I did have the archaeology. I think that there certainly was already an interest in all civilizations in but it was very linked to the artistic side of things. And myself. Yes, I was. I was painting at a time I was doing a lot of photography. But to continue the story is when I finished the degree, then I said, Okay, well, I'm going to continue studying. I was very young at a time only 21. But I'm going to do what we're, I believe my love and my passion is in disease art. So that's when I moved to the states to Boston, specifically, and I went for another bachelor's degree, a BFA in Visual Communication, I head on business studies. It's what has allowed me to evolve and to grow into a leader of a large team in in a big agency where I believe it's not just about word, what is your your creative acumen or your expertise A lot has to do with how you understand the business, right? When I left college, I had the opportunity to work for an agency called Trinity communications. And it was fantastic. I was on some of the lead accounts. And it really got me exposed to what what is the agency world, like, it was my first job, real job, let's say after school, and it was, it was a great way to start my career. I think there's different different ways of how you can build your career. And I totally respect you know, there's people there who stay at the same place for 20 years. And I think there is a lot of good there. In my case, usually in a five year period, there there has to come a change. And whether it is a big change internally in in where I am a big change that I provoke externally. That seems to be a cycle in my life. So I was ready for that bigger change. And that's what led me to apply to a position at Office Depot. There were at that time starting in Spain and they were looking to build a small team and that would basically take or build the brand. So I I apply for it was a team leader position the creative team leader and and it was a really interesting role because it meant nothing. Nothing was there right? I remember that. Even the offices they were not finished. They were selling construction. So we were like in a garage type of place. We didn't even have proper furniture at type of a startup. Ironically, ironically, exactly. And but and I remember I got there the first day and they told me Okay, you, you had not even yet signed my contract. And they said, you have to go to the to the states for a training for the next couple of weeks. I'm like, okay, but it was very exciting, right? I, yeah of course, yeah. I had to hire all the people. I had to hire my team, I had to get all the technical equipment. So,

 

Robert Berkeley  5:32  

DSo did you have any experience with this? No 00

 

Arancha Muelas  5:35  

No 0 0 experience, I had a great improvised improvise, but I have to say, had I a great manager at the time, she was in the States, Margaret, and she, she really support me in everything I need. They had done these with our countries before. So they knew the procedure. And she certainly was a fantastic mentor. The company grew, the company grew, we opened stores, we opened different areas. My team also grew at the end, we were about 10 people. And we opened also Portugal. So I was responsible for Spain and Portugal.

 

Robert Berkeley  6:09  

Did you fail along the way? I presume the work you were you were getting there was some creative but there was a lot of adapt adaptation and so on in what you were doing. Were you were you feeling that your creative side was suppressed at all? Or were you feeling that actually, there was so much moving and so much going on that that you didn't have time to think about that?

 

Arancha Muelas  6:25  

Exactly. You know, what's what's what's interesting, when I actually interviewed for them, I remember this. So clearly it was they showed me one of the catalogues they produced, right? I don't know if you're familiar with the catalogues, but even from a creative perspective, a we're not talking about the type of work I was doing at the time coming from coming from a very specialised boutique agency. And I remember looking at the catalogue, and they said, What do you think? And I just bluntly said, Well, honestly, I mean, from a from a designer, from a creative perspective, this will be the nightmare of a designer, however, I said, I think there is a lot of opportunity in this role. And to your point, what I saw back then, is my opportunity to grow as a marketeer my opportunity to be part of because I was in the in that, as a board member part of the board of the team, there was an opportunity to learn about people to learn about being a manager. So for all these different reasons, I decided to take the job. And that's what kept me also focused and growing my interest and my own skills in all these different areas, which were not necessarily what was my nature back then. But it did become also my epic interest. And I don't know if it was aware of Mark, to be honest at that time, but what I realise now is that by naturally focusing my interest in the other sides of the business, is where what I was doing is building a more solid foundation of again, what has allowed me for later in my career in the direction that I took it.

 

Robert Berkeley  8:00  

Okay, so sSo you were at Office Depot in Spain, and then you launched Portugal, and you made a move then to to the romantic Venlo in the Netherlands. You're familiar with Finland, I have driven through Venlo quickly, few times.

 

Arancha Muelas  8:15  

It's a more charming village that you would think I can imagine. However, yes. When this was also one of those interesting anecdotes or funny anecdotes. My boss at the time, who is the European, the European creative director, he called me and he said, Listen, Aranchaurantia we are building our European team. It was at the time the company was going from a localization strategy to a to a globally strategy, or European strategy. And I need a European creative manager, would you be interested in a position and this was the year that I was getting married, I was free. I was really in my comfort zone, to be honest. And like you just described then, though, is not initially the most exciting place to be, especially when you come from a big city. And I said, You're kidding me, right? I'm like, I'm, I'm not moving to vandal, I had a great relationship with Him. And I'm like, do you really want me to move to Venlo from Madrid? And he said, Okay, I understand. But would you come for a couple of months assignment and help me build a team and hire the person that will take this position? I'm like, Yeah, of course. So I wonder for what initially was a two month assignment. And I stayed for five years. I found my passion. Again, I was taking everything I was doing to bigger place. My impact had to was all around Europe included APAC as well. And the dynamic of the teams of the people of providing the creative direction of setting help him be part of the bigger strategic conversations in the team that just fuel my passion. And I was working, I mean enough hours a day, but I didn't mind I knew that's what I wanted to do.

 

Robert Berkeley  10:06  

So the passion specifically was what though, because you were creating something from nothing, you were building this team and getting it aligned with the rest of the business. But what was the thing specifically that got you out of bed every morning that during that period,

 

Arancha Muelas  10:19  

probably is the end, if you, if you look at what I've been just explaining what has been the different steps, one of my main motivations, but what drives me as an individual is being able to have an impact, being able to bring value at to the team to the organisation. So the just like I had the opportunity earlier on when I joined Office Depot to build a team, I had the same opportunity here is building a team that I knew was going to support the business it was going to drive it was going to be aligned with the new strategy, this new global strategy and help support the business in in succeed. In addition, it was at a bigger scale. So I was learning from I was coming from managing what was a good decent sized team, if we're spinning protocol now for Europe. And I was learning about different how to deal with different people, the long distance aspects of things, which also brings the challenge of when you're not there everyday how you do that remotely, how I was able to become a better a better leader, this scene talking about the impact how the responsibility that came with that in aligning all the brands under one brand that is coherent, as consistent as congruent with what the brand want it to be for the Europe and APAC regions.

 

Robert Berkeley  11:44  

So the challenge seemed quite great. Was it daunting when you're daunted when you went to Venlo? And were asked to build and develop this team?

 

Arancha Muelas  11:54  

You know, there were I have to admit, there were moments at the beginning that I'm like, how am I going to do these, just like when you asked me when I first took the responsibility of managing the Spain and Portugal regions, I had nothing, no one there to tell me exactly what to do. This was new. Nobody had done this before. I was a different level. So I think there were also expectations of me. But at that time I and maybe this is something, something I have also evolved and grow. But I believe that I had to know how to do things, or at least that's what I had to show and figure things out by myself. I think later on through the years, I've learned that well, you don't always have to have all the answers. And it's okay to ask for help. So this has been a big lesson. But I have to say also, you know, these believes that I had to figure things out also gives you the energy and the motivation to figure things out yourself. I had I have to say as well, a fantastic manager back then. And Kurt Wagner, who I we had a great relationship, and he was there for anything I needed. But I believe it was my so there was a lot of weight I was putting on myself in terms of you have to figure this out. You have to do this. And at the end you do right.

 

Robert Berkeley  13:10  

In the end you do for better or worse in the end you do and I guess the outcome of that led you to your job at Vvistaprint. That right, so that was very conveniently you started when was that at the beginning of 2011? I think. Yeah. As creative director. Well, so how did that come about? And what did that entail? So Vvistaprint wanted you back in Spain? Because they were didn't have a major operation? And am I thinking about I'm thinking Oh, say Oh, say we're in Venlo went there as well.

 

Arancha Muelas  13:36  

Oh, say no. Vvistaprint as well. But Vvistaprint it's what we have in in Venlo. It's the it's our plant. So it's the printing plant. We don't have any of the marketing offices. And so yes, they, I found this was this was the opportunity of my life for for all the different reasons I explained before. And I write before at the beginning of the process, because it was quite a long process. We tend to do that Vvistaprint long interview processes. But I told myself, if this was for me, this moves forward, I want to do this. This is a it's my time to do this. I from a more intuitively perspective than rational. I knew that that was the next step. And indeed, it was because I got the job offered. And I moved to Barcelona. So the first two, three years, my role was just a European role. And we had no connection with the Boston office yet. That happened to three years. Right.

 

Robert Berkeley  14:35  

Right I see. So So now Vvistaprint have long had in house, an in house agency. And that's part of been part of their culture for quite a while I think in Boston, what was happening then in Europe, that was if you weren't directly aligned with them, what, what was the setup there?

 

Arancha Muelas  14:51  

Yeah. So it was very different. And you know, interesting enough, my responsibility where I joined was to build it. We didn't have a team But the team had been a can, I'm not gonna go into into the details, but the way it was structured, they were working very independently into different groups into specific countries. And part of the reasons why I was wire higher was to bring all the team under one umbrella. So did each country

 

Robert Berkeley  15:17  

So so did each country have their own team in their own country?

 

Arancha Muelas  15:19  

Exactly. Not in their own country, they were all based in Barcelona. So

 

Robert Berkeley  15:23  

all okay, so they'd be servicing the UK from Barcelona, exactly Barcelona, but but they'd been separate teams focused on those particular regions.

 

Arancha Muelas  15:30  

Exactly. And these separate teams a were combined, were part of an combined unit that included the marketing manager, right. So different, different roles.

 

Robert Berkeley  15:42  

And I'm way beyond the kind of basic brand guidelines we was there any strategic direction globally, or within like, literally just doing what was right for that what they felt was right for that.

 

Arancha Muelas  15:52  

Yes So well, you're familiar with Vvistaprint Vvistaprint. It's a very successful company that started with a very aggressive promotional marketing model. And in that model, there was really not as space for brand strategy, as we know it, as we know it today, it was more a marketing machine, let's put it that way. So from that perspective, there were no real guidelines,

 

Robert Berkeley  16:14  

they're very tactical, it'll grow very quickly cemetery tentacles for solving immediate problems, without any strategic overview, up to that point.

 

Arancha Muelas  16:23  

So but this is where things are right. In the old world, things were not where they wanted to go, necessarily. So by hiring me and some other people is to evolve the company, I always use the analogy of, of a teenager Vvistaprint had grown very quickly. And but you know, when you grow so quickly, especially with this very aggressive promotional strategy, what happens is, you're really not adding value to the customer beyond that great offer that they get at that one time. So there's nothing really that's gonna make them come back, right, and want to stay with you. So this is basically the moment where Vvistaprint was having these reflections and defining, well, what is next for us, we've done these very

 

Robert Berkeley  17:10  

Dogood, you have a lot of customers, you knew who they were, they transacted with you, but there was no no thought about how you develop those as customers and build a relationship. So that exactly as a kind of annuity coming from them all the time. And that was part of your role. Had you done that at Office Depot was at a concept you were familiar with? Or was it just that Office Depot no was really a more mature company generally, and you could bring that experience with you indefinitely. So

 

Arancha Muelas 17:33  

Indefinitely. So Office Depot was a more mature company, we did have proper brand guidelines, we did touch beyond pure digital marketing a lot of different areas. So it's a completely different setup. What I found in Vvistaprint, at that time, was very heavy on online marketing, email affiliate display. And but without really a direction, or long term perspective, or view of what the brand was meant to be, or the value we wanted to add to the customers. And so this was the situation when I joined. But like I said, there was already conversations and initiatives geared towards finding what is the value to the customer and building an internal connection to the customers, it's important that your team feels and knows, what is your purpose? What is your value? What is the value you're providing to their customers, before we even go to the customers and tell them. So that happened in I would say, during the first couple of years. And then as part of that transition, as well into this new model, we became a global team. So and that's probably where we, you first heard about Vvistaprint, we first met, and we all came under the umbrella of our VP of internal agency VP, that was the one and only Bridget Bridget or Ryan fantastic, amazing professional at a better human being and a great friend and my my boss at the time. And she she had a vision, she was putting the organisation with a woman that knew where is the right place to evolve, how to build a brand. She knew everything about what our customers were. And she did a fantastic job in first combining the agency, the internal agency into being one team and second set that direction of where we had to move and evolve.

 

Robert Berkeley  19:29  

Where are you now you're at Vvistaprint you've been there a little while nine years or so. And I think your title, your lovely title, Director of global brand strategy and the creative agency. But what does that mean? What have you got in terms of a team globally? Tell us a little about how it's structured.

 

Arancha Muelas  19:45  

Yeah, so we have a team of it's going to be close to 60. It's a global team, and it's composed by designers looking at different channels. So everything from email to display, we also take care have, we have our brand within Vvistaprint called promotic. And we also serve all the different communication needs for that brand. We have copywriters, and a lot of changes happening from an org structure. We have a new executive team and a lot of fantastic and exciting initiatives. And one of that is becoming more local again. So we are building local teams. So these these on top of the central themes that I was defining earlier that work on all the communications and campaign concepts centrally, we are building dedicated local teams.

 

Robert Berkeley  20:35  

Okay. Okay. And within the In Houseenhanced agency, if you've got that you're leading, you're reporting directly to marketing

 

Arancha Muelas  20:44  

and reporting directly to our cmo who's cmo based in Boston?, based in Boston.? Yes,

 

Robert Berkeley  20:49  

I see. Okay. And so you are considered part of the marketing operation there? Yes, definitely. And marketing work with you hand in hand, are they are they mandated to use you today? Do you also work with the agency of record, we

 

Arancha Muelas  21:03  

We work hand in hand. I one of the things and I believe it's the key for success is to establish a relationship, a partner relationship with the teams that you have to work closely with our customer doesn't know of marketing or creative or it knows about what they get, and the best symbiosis that can happen between the teams that have to make it happen. That's the belief that this recipe for success.

 

Robert Berkeley  21:28  

My question is really how do you ensure that you're, you're I don't want to say getting requests for marketing, but that you're responding to what marketing need, and you're working with them on various projects and campaigns and maybe even larger sort of strategic programmes? How does that work? Do you have account managers, project managers?

 

Arancha Muelas  21:45  

Okay, the details? Yes, we do have project managers, but we also encourage the teams to talk and speak directly. So we moved years ago to an agile model. And an agile model redefines the roles of the different individuals where individuals are empowered to self organise themselves take the wrong decisions. And I have to say we we have evolved to a different place. Now what did at that moment is that didn't remove but redefine the role of the product managers to be more facilitators and enablers rather than they in between the going between between marketing and creative? I'm a strong believer of our communication. As I was saying earlier, I think that the best we can serve our customers is the finding that symbiosis between the teams I have to make this happen.

 

Robert Berkeley  22:38  

You're looking at these project managers, though, to bring more value to to the marketers than just prep manage a project

 

Arancha Muelas  22:43  

Yes. To the marketers to the creatives. Exactly.

 

Robert Berkeley  22:46  

Okay. So are they in any sense what you might in a traditional agency called planners,

 

Arancha Muelas  22:50  

they they play different roles. I mean, you can talk about planners, they look at the make sure that all the different requests are on track, they do flag if there is resources issues, but we use that ticket pool model. So they are not the ones necessarily as in a traditional model, assigning in a more rigid way, what the projects are, and who needs to take them. This is what I'm saying, you know, we're part of our the Agile transformation that we went through a years ago was finding a solution that sort of apply some of those principles, which is based on a ticket pool model, and with scrums, sprints, and they play that role that I defined earlier, as enablers making sure that the machine is running the processes running, but they are not controlling. If that makes sense. You keep

 

Robert Berkeley  23:41  

talking about empowerment. And we did chat earlier. And we talked a little bit about Daniel Pink's book drive that talks not so much about empowerment, which I think he actually specifically goes out of his way to disparage but he talks about autonomy. But are you a fan of Daniel Pink's approach to what motivates people?

 

Arancha Muelas  24:01  

Yes. So you know, whether it's empowerment and autonomy, you know, this could be more semantics, I think, is what what we mean by this idea of autonomy. And for me, it's all very linked to the capacity of an individual to feel that they can control their or they can control their destiny, their what they're doing is move from a place of feeling a victim to owning the situation. And with that comes a process of understanding who you are as an individual, which are your areas of growth, how you what is the responsibility and accountability also, that you take in being part of a team or being part of a project and knowing that you're not going to be told or directed what to do, but it's up to you to take that responsibility.

 

Robert Berkeley  24:52  

Right, right. So Daniel Pink talks about autonomy. He talks about mastery, and he talks about purpose and those being the three things That are far better motivators than punishment and rewards and, you know, commissions and bonuses and money and that kind of thing. Is this something that you've sort of naturally grown into? Or did you kind of read the book and have a conversion at that point? Or is this really Wait, what you've tried to do all along? anyway?

 

Arancha Muelas  25:17  

Yeah, I know, I want to say it's been a ha moment, I read about these three concepts. And I thought, This is what I want to do. Maybe this has helped organise the thought in a way that is more structure and simple, but it's three very powerful ideas. And my belief is, in general, in organisations, we are organisations that we but in general, they tend to focus or invest in developing the knowledge or the skills or the competencies of the employees, and but they forget about what are the human aspects, and the reality is, at the end, we're all human beings, and finding what is that intrinsic motivation and be able to tap into that, for someone to feel fulfilled, that's, I believe, is the secret for any organisation to become successful, because when you have fulfilled employees, you're going to have employees that are motivated, that they have to drive, they're going to become innovative, they're going to want to collaborate better, and become a better version of themselves. In order to do that, going back to the thought of the concept of autonomy is key feeling that you own that, that you're part of that second mastery, it's about knowing going back to skills, which is important, it's about continuous improvement, it's about how you have to continuously look at how you can get better now that you have the tools to become a better professional at your craft. And finally, the sense of purpose, it's all about meaning and understanding what is the bigger picture. And that is important for the and I think it's a responsibility from the from the leadership team to provide the our employees, the clarity and the visibility to understand what what is the purpose of the brand, what we're doing here every day, and so that they feel and they connect with that. So this is my understanding of Daniel Pink's three ideas. But as I was saying, before, I believe it's the three elements that IDN tap into the intrinsic motivation of an individual to feel fulfilled. And it's something as simple as that, or a concept as simple as that. It's not yet so integrated into the society, I believe.

 

Robert Berkeley  27:34  

And it's quite difficult to integrate into a corporate structure that, as you indicated earlier, might not, might not be necessarily receptive to that. But on the other hand, you had the department? So have you been able to develop these ideas and put them into practice? Do you think I do

 

Arancha Muelas  27:48  

I do my best, I'm sure I can make things better, certainly, and my team can speak for this type of message, whether it's when we have Be creative meetings we just had in Barcelona, or creative summit, we had a good conversation about these concepts, and these ideas, my encouragement to really have feel they can take and they can own their own their own challenges. And they know that I'm here to help to solve if they need me to do that. But first, I want them to try to do it by themselves. And I do invest and I in the employees in in grinders skills, they have a specific training budget, where I believe it's linked to this idea and this purpose in think about what is it that's going to make you a better creative? I don't care so much what that is, in terms of what is the training course I plan to take, but something that you believe it's going to make you better and invest in that? And, and communication? Yes, that's something I make sure that the team is clear about what their role is, and how this links to the bigger purpose of the company. Again, you know, it's all work in progress. I, this is a foundation from where I built my or I direct my team, and doing a better or worse job at the end, if you know what you're doing. And you know that this is right, you get people understand and align to that vision. Right. And you see that in terms of the outcome of the work,

 

Robert Berkeley  29:21  

and of course, and in terms of the effort that they put in and yeah, and tell me what gets them out of bed in the morning as well.

 

Arancha Muelas  29:28  

Yeah, exactly. And, you know, there is, especially in a large team, there's gonna be all different motivations, different personalities. So it's also understand that that's the case. And for me, I believe it's also focusing on the ones that need that more to not not quite seeing some of these concepts to help them get into this place. Yeah, that is where the work is.

 

Robert Berkeley  29:54  

I'm curious, you said that. When you were early part of your career, you were very happy to work morning. noon and night on this. Are you still having to do that? And if you're not, what do you what are you doing in your spare time?

 

Arancha Muelas 30:07  

Well, I, one of the lessons I learned is just like if you have a hobby and you spend 12 hours in your hobby, right, it's not about your hobby, it's all about balance. And and it's not so much about work life balance, because I don't believe in that concept. I believe that we are individuals that you're the same person at work or your personal life. And there is different dimensions around you. One is work. And another one is your social relationships. And another one is your intellectual capacity. And another one could be your spirituality and our one is your your home life, right? So I believe in looking at your at the individual or your own self in with this holistic perspective, and as I was saying earlier, is how you keep a balance between all of them. And as important as age to be dedicated to your job. It is to also find what are those other things that make you a better person that are by nature you're attracted to that is part of it, it raises your curiosity, to become an all rounded individual. So sorry, this was a long answer. Interesting,

 

Robert Berkeley  31:15  

Interesting, though. Interesting. So be specific, then how do you attend to do that?

 

Arancha Muelas  31:19  

Yeah, so I do have different different activities outside of work. And one is, I'm actually very interested in the startup world. So I'm an angel investor. And I'm part of a couple of different funds. And what's unique about these funds is that they are managed by women. So it's women fund investors, supporting startups, led by women as well. So that's that's one area I'm also very involved in community work in different areas. So one is from in the educational world, I collaborate with universities, whether it is being part of the programmes, or masterclasses on a specific topic. And in addition, I do volunteer and work, and especially connect with organisations that focus on on on the privilege youth that don't have the same opportunities as others, and to be able to bring a perspective, so they have an opportunity in life as well. I work closely with one in Barcelona call from a few areas. And through Vvistaprint, I also had the chance to collaborate with a princess trust in the UK, which is a fantastic organisation to live you're familiar with, on the so this, I would say additional activities, but from what you describe as hobbies, I got run for hobbies as well. I have room for hobbies. There's room for everything. Again, if you just have to make sure it's good planning. I'm a runner. I like running. I have run, very proud of saying have run a couple of half marathons, one in Sierra Leone, and another one in Nepal for charity.

 

Robert Berkeley  33:00  

charity. whirpool sounds a bit hilly for doing half marathons. Oh my god, he was, I didn't quite Think about that. I would have started off and run downhill the whole way. But

 

Arancha Muelas  33:11  

yeah.

 

Arancha Muelas  33:14  

yeah. yeah. But you know, once you do it, and once you see what you're capable of, it's it's a fantastic experience. And one of my passions, it's anything related to well being I This means meditation, personal growth topics, so I consume a lot of literature related to just personal growth. purpose in life. I love the world and cultures. So travel is a big one as well. Anything related to astronomy, food, fine dining, or simple food. It's It's It's another project definitely

 

Robert Berkeley  33:48  

definitely in the right place in Barcelona for food. Oh, yes. Oh, yes. Alright, so I want to thank you so much for telling us about your very full life. And your fascinating career there, and where it's taking you in the world. And if any listeners have Iinside Jjobs, want to get hold of you and ask you about any aspect of what you've been doing, how should they best do that or enter?

 

Arancha Muelas  34:11  

Oh, please. Oh, well, they can reach me directly at my email address, which is amuelas wellness amuelaAMU e. l a s@vistaprint.com. And I love to talk more. I love to share experiences with others. So Robert, it was lovely to talk to you. Thank you for this opportunity also to share my experiences. And if you want me back at any time, just let me know.

 

Robert Berkeley  34:37  

Thanks to a Arancharancher for your time and giving us that insight into your career and specifically your take on Daniel Pink's book drive which by the way, I highly recommend it's a very good read and can actually change your perspective perhaps on the way you work. Before I go. I just want to thank printer and DVR at Express KCS for their editing skills. Prateek Srivastava for being such a patient producer with me. And of course Emily Foster and I have for her unwavering help and partnership in bringing this episode and this podcast series to all of you. If you have time, please go to iTunes or Spotify and make a comment as long as it's a good one. Of course five star reviews are always welcome. And indeed go to the Inside Jobs podcast.org website and sign up for our mailing list. See you next time.