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Robert Berkeley  0:02  

Hello and we're back with another inspiring episode of Inside JobsInside jobs brought to you by IHAF have the leading professional association for in house agencies and Eexpress KCS who manage the production while in house agencies do the thinking for this episode, IHAF have had the immense pleasure of talking to Luis RuvalcabaRavel Carbo of IDC. Now he's a man who likes to challenge and as you're here, he's always ready to rise to meet it. Clearly he's exhilarated by engaging head on with the unknown. And he offers us a case study in being bold and coming through Luis, welcome to Inside JobsInside jobs.

 

Luis Ruvalcaba  0:40  

Thanks for inviting me to do your podcast excited to be here. And currently, I'm a Ccreative Ddirector, Wworldwide Ccreative Ddirector at IDC out of the Boston area,

 

Robert Berkeley  0:50  

and IDC rings a bell what's IDC up to. IDC

 

Luis Ruvalcaba 0:53  

IDC, Iinternational Ddata Corporation., Iit's a it's a global research marketing firm. It was founded by Pat McGovern, one of the tech tTitans in the Boston in Silicon Valley. And its sister company is IDGidg Ccommunications Macworld PC World all those great publications that that we grew up with during the the digital early use of the digital age.

 

Robert Berkeley  1:14  

So quite a quite a heritage heritage. It's kind of traditional publishing, but obviously brought into the present day with the with the data side of the business. Right. And your creative director there. What does that involve day to day quickly?

 

Luis Ruvalcaba  1:25  

Yeah, creativecrib director. The interesting thing is, I have a being a worldwide Creative Director of Global teams, so I don't have any staff with me in the Boston area. My primary, my core group is in Prague. And then I have a team in the Philippines, a team in Spain, there's a team in Egypt, there's a few other designers kind of sprinkled out through the middle east Turkey and the Dubai and in West Germany. Yeah. So when I first got here, it was just the core team out of Prague, but over the years, we've been able to align the regional teams under a worldwide design, as you know, we have this new kind of initiative under new leadership to have a globally aligned brand, right, so...

 

Robert Berkeley  2:09  

Vvery important. Well, we'll come on to how that all developed and the challenges you have of managing that later on. It's a fascinating model that you've got there and not very common to be honest. Not yet anyway, although i think that i think that's gonna change. But take us back to is Tucson, Arizona, isn't it that you come from tell us a little bit about your background and how you got into the whole world of being creative?

 

Luis Ruvalcaba  2:30  

Right so Tucson, Arizonatucson arizona writes I grew up in Tucson, Arizona, you know, my father and his brothers had a custom Spanish colonial furniture making business in Mexico so there were three brothers one was a businessman. One was the Bohemian artist one and my dad was kind of in between the two so they all kind of seem to have a certain creative slant to them but yeah, so everybody was draw we'd go to the workshops in Mexico and and we'd see all the drawings and everything so at an early age drawing was just part of our our nature and so I just always was drawing and throughout elementary school junior high in high school until eventually you know getting a scholarship to go take figure drawing classes in high school which was pretty interesting and then that led to obviously exploring additional art opportunities outside where I eventually landed in San Francisco and went to the Academy of Art.

 

Robert Berkeley  3:28  

So you are naturally drawn to drawing and naturally drawn to kind of the creative arts with your with your with your hands really developed developing ideas using using pencils and

 

Luis Ruvalcaba  3:38  

this will seem I guess, you know, some people right, I was drawing mostly

 

Robert Berkeley  3:44  

I write how these things develop out of the out of your environment and circumstance and the fact that your your your uncles and your father were in this business it gave you an opportunity to kind of hang out and start to be if you wanted to do carpentry I guess or if you wanted to go into the commercial side there all those opportunities available but this was obviously quite a strong pull for you.

 

Luis Ruvalcaba 4:03  

you. Yeah, I kind of regret not going into the kind of the custom wood making furniture because it is a lost art now that you know looking back over the years it it's it's not what it used to be.

 

Robert Berkeley  4:12  

No Well, you know, you could you could be worse there's a there's a fellow in the UK who's the last certified vellum producer. So he's the only one who's certified to take goatskin and prepare it for writing in the UK our laws are still written on vellum Would you believe so? So you know there are some even more lost arts out there but I think yeah, it's not too late late you can you can always kind of throw in the talent get into that.

 

Luis Ruvalcaba  4:36  

Bbut yeah, I think I've got my retirement or just pure drawing obviously but with a digital slant. I think so.

 

Robert Berkeley  4:42  

I guess I'll school and then on and to the Wwest Ccoast. Right. So

 

Luis Ruvalcaba  4:46  

Right right... So you know, going into art school, I guess. You know, you go into art school thinking you want to be an artist right with those aspirations.

 

Robert Berkeley  4:51  

You want to be a fine art,

 

Luis Ruvalcaba 4:52  

Rright? You want to be an artist want to be a painter, right? Yeah. Right. And then you know, then you start learning about other things right then and you know, I was already thinking good at drawing that we had this old Italian teacher Michael Aangelo Ddivincenzo. And first thing he did, in the first day of class, he said one thing that stuck with me and he said in his broken English, he said, I just want to say one thing, nobody gets an A in this class. So just forget about it. Nobody gets an A. And I'm sitting there, you know, getting my pencils ready and whatnot. And I said, I remember saying to myself, well, we'll see about that. And you know, sure enough, during the course of the semester, he'd come around, he give us demonstration, then it comes around, he come around to me, and he says, Yeah, you're pretty good. There, you're pretty good. And my friends started teasing me. But at the end of the semester, that when the grades got posted, there was one a, the only a he ever gave.

 

Robert Berkeley  5:38  

So is that what it takes to motivate you? Just to be told something can't be done?

 

Luis Ruvalcaba 5:41  

Actually, what what motivates? Yeah, is what you know, when you somebody tells you can't do something, right. So you start off an ad, or you start off in fine art? And then you have I have a teacher's, you know, I took some advertising classes, and one of the teachers said, You'll never be a good art director. And I said, Oh, I'll show you next. What happens next? I'm working in advertising, right, as an art director, it's because I could draw, but I could also think, right, so that was the thing about advertising is you could draw in and you know, back then, in the 90s, right, it says, you don't want to be just a wrist, right? They called a wrist, right? You just told what to draw. I do not want to draw what's in my mind, or I want to draw my thoughts, my thinking is my problems, my solutions. So advertising and art directors really kind of give you an opportunity to do that. Right? So when you have a TV assignment or Aads, get the strategy and you have to sketch things out think things through could be a design, it could be a commercial a storyboard, it could be a you know, photograph your your kind of prepping for photoshoots but you know, if you could draw it and think it and draw it and then have people understand it, then you're in a better position to kind of you know, be in the driver's seat rather than being told what to draw

 

Robert Berkeley  6:47  

or what to do. Definitely. So this is another motivator for you I guess, as well to expand to to expand from just as you say, being a risk someone who could draw to someone who could conceptualisatione.

 

Luis Ruvalcaba  6:58  

Cconceptualiszation, right, and attaching that conceptualiszation, ability to strategy and business problems, right. That was the key when you could do that and solve people's business problems. That's the key.

 

Robert Berkeley  7:09  

Well, although I know much of your career is around in house agencies. You did therefore start within a traditional agency, Yyoung and Yyoung &and Rubicam. rugam. Another

 

Luis Ruvalcaba 7:18  

Rubicam agency is Fabian extraordinaireextraordinare, from small agency in San Francisco is actually the agency that that started working on the California Ccooler accounts way back then that was the first agency. And then Yyoung &and Rubicam, that's where I did a lot of TV commercials, and a lot of travelling that I you know, yeah, it was very fun. But it was, it's like, they say advertising. After a while I can bring you out or after a while you can come to the realisation is like, are these TV commercials really doing anything of great value rather than just push it product? Right? And I think that's that...

 

Robert Berkeley  7:47  

And I think that's that great of an experiment, right? Am I contributing to the world here?

 

Luis Ruvalcaba  7:51  

Right? How many car talking cars can can? I do? Right? So I did the first Spanish talking car for Chevron, talking cars that they do, you know, and after a while, you know, how many AT&Tat&t commercials can you do? Or Radio Shack commercials that it just, you know, got to it wasn't exciting anymore. And then so that's when that's the close of the 90 and you hear the you know, you hear you're starting to hear the sound of pixels growing louder to kind of, you know, as a digital age is approaching and you know, this train's coming, and you don't want to miss that boat. And so I started dabbling and getting up to speed on you know, what's it mean to become a creative in the digital age? You know, web designers that are web design back then was is a it was wild west, right? You didn't really there were no roles.

 

Robert Berkeley  8:35  

So with all this new technology coming along, were you dDid you already have a technical bent any way? Were you comfortable with the technologies from the get go?

 

Luis Ruvalcaba  8:42  

Well, I think so. Because, you know, I took to the computer fairly quickly. So I think some people just have a disposition I think to certain things and you know, you take to something like a duck to water or you kind of dip your toes and kind of have second thoughts but I didn't have second thoughts at all I dove headfirst into

 

Robert Berkeley  8:59  

Didso you remember your first digital engagement, your non non print non TV engagement.

 

Luis Ruvalcaba  9:03  

Notand that specifically, you know, back then we started into Adobe right so Adobe Suite right so Adobe started buying things like PpageM maker, you heard these early software programmes PpageMmaker and Quarkcourt and all those things we were working on for publishing and to create these but they didn't have they were just for print. So when Adobe came along and started to kind of aggregate all the software and it started you know, you can see where that was going. It was going towards digital it was going towards motion, you know, back then in the 90s, late 90s there was you know, people were doing interactive CDs right DVDs and at the end the programming languages LINGOlingo so I started learning LINGOlingo to learn how to programme and do that I remember that You had no fearair.  Nonow but you know, it gets to the point where when you immerse yourself at something, you know, I started dreaming and LINGOlingo I remember dreaming and LINGOlingo is like, but that they don't use that language anymore, right, but

 

Robert Berkeley  9:55  

I forgotten about LINGOlingo till you mentioned it just then. Yeah, so tell me you were at the agent. See, and but you did then move pretty quickly to what I think we could safely call in house. Well, yeah, so how did that transition happen?

 

Luis Ruvalcaba  10:06  

yeah, so how did that transition happen? What Wwell actually was so again, so as a as an angel coming to a close and and you know, I wanted out of market out of advertising, I started looking around and recruited from the Boston area reached out and had this opportunity at this marketing firm. I turned to the first I turned it down, he called back again a few months later, and it was more of a direct marketing firm, but he kind of, you know, talked my ear off and said, well, they're they're really looking for someone with agency experience, you know, they want to really expand their their capabilities. So I said, I'll listen, they flew me out to Boston to the Lincoln area company called prevision. mMarketing. And, you know, it's cold as hell,

 

Robert Berkeley  10:43  

I've got to say that, yeah, you probably weren't used to the weather,

 

Luis Ruvalcaba 10:45  

rRight? It was middle of January, I remember was like, 15 degrees and pit. You know, we talked and there's a good group of people smart group, they were doing some good stuff. And I, you know, at the end the day, I said, you know, if I'll join if you if you make me a CD of interactive, right, I've never been a CD of interactive, I was, I was a Ssenior Aart Ddirector, I associate creative.

 

Robert Berkeley  11:02  

I was like a man who had nothing to lose, right? So

 

Luis Ruvalcaba  11:03  

So, yeah, I said, I want you know, if you if you guys are willing to go down the road of interactive and digital media, you know, all come on board, if you do that, so that they did, they brought me on board and I...

 

Robert Berkeley  11:14  

Wwere you confident that you knew what you were doing at that point? Like I said, it was a wild, wild west, you know, kingdom of the blind, wild man, all that, you know,

 

Luis Ruvalcaba  11:22  

he just learned you learn as you go, you know, and he started to we started taking, I started taking more and more flash courses. I forgot what else

 

Robert Berkeley  11:31  

you couldn't just pop onto YouTube and learnlone flash.

 

Luis Ruvalcaba  11:35  

convoluted and that right? Exactly, you had to go out and take some courses. And there would be there were a few people out there giving courses. So you know, and, you know, we just learned as we went along, and just started building your skill set. And that and I think that's the key. That's the key, you know, for me anyways, like you start your career, I don't know about all careers. But I know, in the creative field, I can relate to that more than anything, but you start your career with a core competency, right. So mind going back with drawing, right. And over the years, you add to that core competency, and over the years, you know, whether it's strategy, whether it's concepting, type pa typography, you every skill set, and what happens is, so a course a core, it just visualise a core skill set as a circle, every competency that you add adds a plane to it, that comes a polygon, then that polygon then becomes to take shape. So it becomes more dimensionalizing. The more not that you need a lot of skill sets, but you can take a certain low amount of skill set that can really benefit you as an individual in the career path. And I think that's what the way I had always looked at it.

 

Robert Berkeley  12:37  

It seems to me that at every stage, though, you've sort of followed the advice that you had in the when you were a college, which is the you seem to set yourself goals and then then backfill from there, right? It takes a bit of a risk little you have to be a little bit bold, and that's what life's about. Yeah, calculated risk, calculated risk. So now you stay here in Boston now. So you stayed on the East Coast, the weather didn't put you off too much, right? No, actually no.

 

Luis Ruvalcaba  13:00  

No, actually no. So then after when I was at prevision, then you had the dot bomb, and 911 here, right? So remember that there were layoffs and retrenching going on. So there was a layoffs there in 2009 11. And after a few months at Bose, I was recruited join a company that and this was actually my first in house assignment BJs wholesale club of confidential recruiting research going on. And somebody contacted me they were looking for someone with agency experience, web experience, and the to to manage this large Iin Hhouse Aagency, I'd like to sell 25 people. And when I went to the website, I was horrified. I was just horrified at what I saw. But then I also realised,

 

Robert Berkeley  13:44  

because it was so excellent. There was no way you could possibly top it. Yeah, exactly. No, It's horrifying. It's awful. Right? Well, I think you should be delighted in that case. Exactly.

 

Luis Ruvalcaba  13:52  

Exactly. Right. Exactly. So it didn't take long to realise that the opportunity was at hand. So I joined BJs as creative director there for those are for four or five years. And but after a while, you know, it's for me, it's a challenging, it's like, I get bored really easily. I need to be challenged, I need to be engaged. And after a while I did a lot of things that I set out to do. And I had set up a succession plan and I was ready to move on, move on. So I moved on and then spent a little bit of time freelancing at fidelity on some interesting area, interactive things. And then I was recruited by the boston globe to become the greatest creative director at the Boston Globe media.

 

Robert Berkeley  14:31  

Well, this was this was moments before the big downturn in newspapers. Exactly right. So very last bit before 2008 was their fine with their biggest year ever right

 

Luis Ruvalcaba  14:41  

right and then 2009 the reset up to the age of nine the recession hit right so then that massive layoffs there right massive layoffs across the industry. And then I went back to the west coast and but in the interim, I got sidetracked by a recruiter to go to Capital One for a year and down in Richmond, which I did, I knew was only a temporary thing. But I did that because it was right in the middle of the recession. And they were willing to pay to relocate and, and so I did that. And it was interesting that I ended up going back to California, San Francisco, where I started my career. But now I went back not as an advertising person, but you know, as a creative director with, you know, web skills, or UX UI skills, and a lot of the friends so here's the thing, a lot of the friends that I had left, those years before, who did not make the transition to the digital realm, were really struggling. So a lot of people if you didn't make that, jump, that skill set acquisition, you know, it was it was tough for a lot of people. And, like photography dried up, right, I just, it just totally changed the landscape that I was, I felt I was well positioned. And sure enough, I, you know, I've added a few roles successfactors, SAP and gigya in Silicon Valley. So I spent five years there, six years there, in the Bay Area,

 

Robert Berkeley  16:03  

you're moving along a lot. I mean, is that is that just the way you are that you? Because obviously, you've been IDC now for some years, but is that? Is that a characteristic of you? Or is that you just felt you needed more fulfilment? Or were there other issues at play?

 

Luis Ruvalcaba 16:17  

play? A little bit of both, but I think, you know, the, the so when I went to successfactors, was bought by SAP, right. And then I was recruited so when recruiters come calling, you know, I'm, I'm willing to listen, right? So and so when I was at, I was at SAP for about two years. And then gigya came calling another opportunity. Okay, new environment, new product, right? So every situation presents new learning, and gigya was a Israeli own company. And then they were bought off bought by ASAP to go

 

Robert Berkeley  16:49  

to go back as a pagan.

 

Luis Ruvalcaba 16:51  

No, but at that point, when the when that purchase went through, is when I was recruited to go Oh, I

 

Robert Berkeley  16:57  

Oh, I say so you moved across Okay, cuz I I have heard of people getting jobs and then finding they get acquired by the people I used to work for. And well,

 

Luis Ruvalcaba  17:04  

yeah, but not the people I used to work for. But the Boston area, right, so at now IDC came calling and this was the this one really. So this role really grabbed my attention, because because of its global footprint and the opportunity to manage a global brand. So So I ended up back here in Boston, I've been here now five years of this company.

 

Robert Berkeley  17:25  

So let's talk about that. Because you said at the beginning of the interview that you have this very geographically spread and and actually, it's not like they're all in the United States, they're culturally spread as well with a with a big C. So that was a learning curve for you, I'm sure. Tell us about what you came into and how that evolved.

 

Luis Ruvalcaba 17:44  

and how that evolved. Alright, so that when I didn't tell ADC, you have to remember that there's the history of ITC is Pat McGovern, he had a very entrepreneurial spirit. And he built these two companies as a, you know, very entrepreneurial, get it done environment. And he left a lot of things to the region's regional managers. And it worked, you know, people succeeded there, the company grew. But after a while, what was missing was, or what was happening was brand fragmentation, there was no brand governance, and you could have, you know, events from different regions on the same topic looking very different. And so that was an issue. And when I arrived at IDC, and one of my driving questions was global company or a conglomeration of companies, you know, I need to know, because without, I can't operate unless I need to know, my understanding is we want, we want to be a global company. And obviously, that's what we wanted to be. But it took a while to kind of get things in place, get the new leadership in place. And now there's really a concerted effort to align the brand, we're doing a brand refresh within the updated logo. With brand governance, it's a global initiative, we have to support the CEO, and the president of the company. So for me, it's very gratifying after four or five years of, you know, really nudging inch by inch by inch to align the designers to put in platforms and put in systems for collaboration across the organisation across regions, we're really starting to see things fall into place now. It's really a transformative kind of experience for me to see that and I hope, I hope the rest of the company and executives who've been there can see that and appreciate that as well. From a brand perspective, it's great. You know, the product is a research, it's the analyst, it's, it's great, it's world class, and we just, you know, my whole objective was to make sure that everything that we publish on the website or through events is world class and does justice to the value that the research brings to the customers which are really as transformative on a social economic and business level.

 

Robert Berkeley  19:46  

So you mentioned when you got there was already a team in Prague,

 

Luis Ruvalcaba  19:49  

I think it was a team in Prague, but it was more or less a help desk team, you know, and, and that was one of the first things that we went about to address was design is not a help desk it's iIt's an integral part of the organisation. It's

 

Robert Berkeley  20:03  

where you asked to build a design team in Prague because you happen to have an office there and it might be beneficial.

 

Luis Ruvalcaba  20:09  

Everything was offshored, a few years before I got there, and it was just operating as a pretty much as a tactical on the tactical level. Yeah, yeah. So it took a little bit of training, retraining, because they hadn't had that leadership before.

 

Robert Berkeley  20:24  

Hhad these people come from agencies themselves, or is this very often a first job,

 

Luis Ruvalcaba  20:28  

Aa lot of them were, they had been in the business in Prague, but not from agencies, maybe for from design firms or tech firms. And you know, there's one Hannah, she's actually from heritage is from Korea, I think, New Zealand or Australia, she grew up. And so she has this international flair to her and she's a great designer. And, you know, my whole approach was to get these people, these designers to really become the thought leaders and subject matter matter experts within the organisation. And I think we've done that.

 

Robert Berkeley  20:58  

And just to be clear from the get go, they weren't just serving their local region, they were serving the company as a whole., right?

 

Luis Ruvalcaba  21:05  

Right, So that the way that it's divided up, it's the to the Pragueprog Team Services worldwide, which is USus and a Central and Eastern Europe. And then there's the Western Europe teams in Spain. The Middle Eastern team is an Egypt and Dubai and Turkey. And then there's the AP team, which services AP and they're out of the Philippines.

 

Robert Berkeley  21:29  

And this is a what you might call follow the saomen process there. Yes, you freely available. That's what we're timezones,

 

Luis Ruvalcaba  21:35  

that's what we're trying to do. Right. So that couldn't have happened a ye ar ago, or two years ago. But now that that conversation is taking place for the sameon, so they can't happen without alignment, it can't happen without platforms and resources in place and. cCollaboration, right. So things like Monday comm for project management envision Canva, for design tools for non designers. There's a lot of things that have to fall into place in order for you to be successful at that. So yeah, absolutely.

 

Robert Berkeley  22:03  

While I'm while you're doing that, you need to align them stylistically as well for the brand. Absolutely. Is that with all these different time zones in operation is that a matter of kind of getting people to get on a call in the middle of the night so that everyone can get on a call with you and lead that? How does that happen? The design

 

Luis Ruvalcaba  22:21  

The design reads, we don't designers into design leads did not report into worldwide, they were on their own, they report into into country managers., Mmanagers who knew nothing about design, they knew about their business and their events, thought to me, that's a disservice to designers, you can't grow a designer into a proper role with proper feedback loops. If you're don't have some sort of design branding skills of your own. So they're kind of that hence the the help desk, right design service Help Desk scenario. So what we've done is put the design lead, so they reported to me now put them in a position to understand literally where the where the brand is going, we meet daily, so they can be then the key touch points to the region's right. So they don't have to come

 

Robert Berkeley  23:09  

to your representative in the region. They don't have to

 

Luis Ruvalcaba 23:11  

They don't have to come to me, even though people will still come to me that, you know, I've empowered them, develop them hopefully to be in a position to speak for the brand in a unified manner.

 

Robert Berkeley  23:22  

And does that also mean that you adopt best practices with briefing and workflow and how that process works? And the general job flow work process? Right.

 

Luis Ruvalcaba  23:32  

So you know, again, you know, the project brief is is an important document. Do we always get it? No? Do we always ask for it? For the most part? Yes. So yeah, a brief is important. The workflow again, we have a process that we try to adhere to, and we're always working on again, you know, we've been working on this over the past, for really over the past two years, it's really accelerated, right? So finally, you know, I'm able to get budgets for things like Canva for non designers with the will design the templates, right? So when the biggest thing is, you want to empower people, you don't want everybody coming to design for everything, because it'll just bog us down, right? But you want to empower people to do solve and go to print press as quick as possible, or designed to press. And we set up templates in Canva for regional teams, to publish their own stuff that will lock things down, right, the logos and themes and whatnot, types colours. So there's brand kits built into that. So that helps that helps with, you know, maintaining a certain brand, level of brand, cohesion, product developments big the we're saying things now that we haven't seen happen in the company. And even a year ago, there's there's really this concerted effort to collaborate to align globally to communicate across disparate teams. So it really you're seeing the change in real time and it's not something that you know, you have to wait for it's happening. I was told that, you know, normally creative direct reporting to the CMO, right? I was told, you're going to be reporting to the CIO. Nice. Oh, well, that's, that's unusual. But I'm listening. So there was reasons for that, which I won't get into. why it makes sense. But so the CIO at first one of the first things he told me, he says, I don't know anything about magic creative director, but you know, but it's been a good relationship, because he's really been supportive in a lot of the things that we're doing. And one of those things was being part of, or establishing a, a global events committee, and there was a global events committee meeting in London that I was invited to present branding to, it was the first time AP, Western Europe, Eastern Europe and the Middle East. all got together to talk about events. And, and then I had a couple hours to talk about branding. So that was the first time that these people came together. And it was the foundation of kind of aligning all the events and all the brand architecture that we were working on with the regional event teams. So that was the first thing. And what that did was set up the subsequent meeting their summit, because I was able to build instil confidence in these managers who managed the budgets and all the people the resources in those regions. And I was able to propose, I said, I want to have a design summit in Prague and invite all the designers from the regions, and they all they all signed up for the first time in 2019. And if 2019, we had worldwide design summit in Prague, and I brought in the designers from the Philippines.

 

Robert Berkeley  26:38  

What a beautiful place to do it as well.

 

Luis Ruvalcaba  26:40  

And we had a full week I had a full agenda of we talked about everything. And we put up a website internally on our intranet that was a foundation to that's what really set the stage for really aligning the teams had those two events not happened.

 

Robert Berkeley  26:57  

Yeah, well, you got it in just in time as well. Yeah, yeah, exactly. Yeah, no, I totally relate. So I think that we're going to have to draw this to a close Luisarry's but I'm curious to know whether there's whether there's anything you do outside running the international creative in house agency for ADC, you read a lot?.

 

Luis Ruvalcaba  27:18  

Well read route. So the summer I read a lot. And the last book that I had three books over the summer, I think it was Tthe Llabyrinth of Sspirits, two books by Carlos Ruiz ZafónCarlos Risa phone, who's a Spanish writer, the first book, The Shadow of the Wind, I read years ago, that I reread it, and then I also read Tthe Llabyrinth of Sspirits. It's it's just great storytelling that takes place in in Barcelona. I also read Dune. Wow,

 

Robert Berkeley  27:44  

Wow, do you know I think as a young man, I tried doing about three times because everyone told me how great he was. I could never I'd like to filmmaking I could never get over the line. Really? Right. Yeah. So

 

Luis Ruvalcaba 27:53  

there's a new film coming out. Yeah, yeah. And then I just picked up Barackbrock Oobama's books on tThat's next on my list.

 

Robert Berkeley  28:01  

Oh, that'll get you 10. Yeah, that'll that'll keep you out of trouble. I'm sure well, while the rest of world while the lockdown persists. Luisouise, thank you so much for joining us on on Inside Jobsinside jobs. If people want to talk to you about how to handle we didn't really talk about the cultural differences and how you deal with that. But if people wanted to contact you and talk about your experiences, they what's the best way to reach you? Sure. Yeah,

 

Luis Ruvalcaba  28:22  

Sure. Yeah, they could reach me on LinkedIn, you know, reading their profile, lLuisewis ruvalcaba@, and LinkedIn. Okay, please.

 

Robert Berkeley  28:29  

We'll have that on the we'll have that on the show notes as well. OhWell, Robert, it was a pleasure. Thank you for having me. Well, thank you very much for your time. It's a fascinating story, the race and has taken us on not only around the United States, but also around the world as well. And yeah, I hope it wasn't too much of a whirlwind. Therefore, it was a bit quick. We could have done it a lot more time. Thank you. Okay. Thanks so much to Luis for joining us on Inside Jobsinside jobs. What really struck me here was how he'd seem to set his sights on an objective without any regard for the way he'd reach it. To him,. oObstacles are just seem to be there to be tackled. And in no way to prevent him doing what he wants to do. I found that message really quite inspiring. Now, thank you so much to our fabulous partners that IHAF have specifically Emily Foster, and my producer Amy MacNamara for making this podcast possible. Also, of course, to Eexpress KCS AV team for handling the podcast editing so efficiently. Now, if you've not come across this podcast before then a very, very warm welcome to you. Ddo take the chance to visit us at our newly rebranded website at ij podcast.com to see the ever expanding back catalogue of episodes. If you've any thoughts or ideas, then feel free to drop a comment there. And also you can sign up to the extremely intermittent ij newsletter. So do please keep the feedback coming.  Ttill the next time.